Another (deeper) look at what might have happened with CellNuvo in August

NOTICE: this post definitely exceeds 2000 characters, although a little shorter than War & Peace. If you're not interested in a deeper look behind the scenes at what may have happened to CellNuvo in August, don't bother reading it.

Nothing here is intended to deny that there are ongoing problems and issues at CellNuvo. I acknowledge many of the same, understand some, don't understand others. I'm simply not addressing them here.

This post was constructed in response to a lengthy discussion in a thread about "no text", and also relates to a new thread, 'Phone Number Restored Directly From Sprint'. In order not to derail either discussion, I've chosen to post this as a new thread:

I'm not sure that the CellNuvo service interruption update was intended to be a complete factual description, nor that it should have been. The intent was to give members a quick, broad overview of what was going on. Keeping accurate to the spirit of what was happening is important, and maybe the exact details were not. The more I look at this, I'm still convinced Tom was telling the truth.

If I understand JTSR71's core arguments correctly (and I've had plenty of opportunities to read them), it's this:

  1. Tom/CN can't be trusted because he lied about a supplier shutting down, so nothing else can be trusted.
    Evidence to support this view: Mobile Matterz is still in business.
  2. No other evidence in the industry of an MVNO enabler going out of business, so Tom must not be telling the truth. .
  3. Any entity involved as an MVNO enabler would have been willing to continue the relationship long enough to get CellNuvo safely to the other side, so Tom must not be telling the truth.
    (And perhaps #4-- I don't like CN despite never having used it, so Tom must not be telling the truth.)

Good catch on the mention of Mobile Matterz JTSR71! For those who didn't follow the original link (provided I believe by arrynrob) the link goes to a supportive comment left on a public webiste (prepaidphonenews) about the shuttering of RingPlus, from one of the principles of Mobile Matterz. While praising CellNuvo as an option, Lind Martin mentioned that CellNuvo was "powered by" Mobile Matterz


  1. Tom wasn't telling the truth because Mobile Matterz is still in business.
    True enough: but there's a big difference between being 'in business', and 'being in the same business'.[/b]

Here's a link to Linda Martin's post in the PrepaidPhoneNews comment section: (You know, down at the bottom section where 95% of the users are named Anonymous, and you can say anything you want without verification. Still, I don't have any difficulty accepting Martin's comment as "essentially true".)

Here's a Wayback Machine capture of the Mobile Matterz home page on June 15, 2016.

Looks like a great fit for CellNuvo! It's all about MVNO enablement, backoffice possibilities, alternative revenue streams, wholesale cellular access, etc.

By Sept 2016, captures indicate a focus on video streaming, health apps, "brand identity", but no direct mention of enabling MVNOs.

Here's the current website: [url=][/url

(Essentially the same home page that's existed since Oct 2016 after one "transition" version.)
Lots of flowery prose that seems to be about content creation, monetizing of streaming video, etc.-- but no mention at all of MVNOs that I could find. As a matter of fact, the only mention of MVNO enablement I could find on any currently existing page, updated within the last year, featuring Mobile Matterz is that PrepaidPhoneNews comment I've looked at their website, their promo materials for industry trade groups, LinkedIn, Facebook, Squarespace, their twitter feed, etc.

It's clear that whatever happened around September 2016, Mobile Matterz decided to not only 'not pursue', but also to actively distance themselves from the MVNO-enablement market. Still in business, yes. Still in the same business? No.

Of course, it's possible that Mobile Matterz had handed the MVNO-enablement business uphill sometime in late 2016 to it's parent company, PC Management. (With Linda Martin also as an executive.) The focus there seems to be on MVNOs, although there's little evidence of aggressive marketing that I could find-- it's possible that PC Management is more of a holding company for MMZ, and other controlled entities, including a sister company of MMZ: Limitless Mobile LLC.

Limitless Mobile LLC, formerly Keystone Wireless, may well be the literal 'keystone' in PC Management (and subsidiaries) providing MVNO services. Keystone Wireless was founded to provide fixed and mobile cellular service to underserved areas in Rural Pennsylvania. It's that company that positioned Linda Martin as somewhat of a mover & a shaker in the mobile industry. Although not large in subscriber numbers, their wholesale agreements with the major carriers seems to have fueled the inroads into the groups MVNO-enablement business. Keystone/Limitless needed access to roaming/wholesale agreements for their customers, and the major carriers needed coverage in rural Pennsylvania. I ran across a federal filing where Keystone/Limitless was pressuring AT&T to provide preferential wholesale rates necessary for Limitless to have a "nationwide presence", and noting that similar agreements were already in place with T-Mobile and Verizon.
In particular, check out their "Wholesale" section, which is targeted at MVNO enablement.

It's possible that Mobile Matterz, PC Management, and Limitless Mobile LLC all negotiated separate wholesale agreements with the big carriers. It seems more likely that the other entities piggybacked on the preferential "nationwide" rates negotiated by Limitless Mobile.

(Footnote: Tracking Limitless Mobile ownership gets a little murky, since they formed new partnerships during an aggressive build-out expansion, and with a European company specializing in MTM and IOT, marketing in the US & Europe. The list of similar entities include at least Limibless Mobile LLC, Limitless Mobile Group, Limitless Mobile Holdings. Bloomberg still identifies Limitless Mobile LLC as a subsidiary of PC Management, with Linda and Richard Marin as key executives. )

Which brings us to original point 2)
2) No other evidence in the industry of an MVNO enabler going out of business, so Tom must not be telling the truth.

Well, actually, there is. At least 3501 bits of evidence.

3500 is the number of the sum total of retail customers of Limitless Mobile who awoke sometime in November 2016 to find that their service had been discontinued, without prior notice.
The "01" comes from the Chapter 11 Bankruptcy filing of Limitless Mobile LLC on Dec 2, 2016.

In the filing, Limitless Mobile acknowledges that it will shutter it's retail operation (I believe they have since released their tower leases, and sold off key transmitting equipment, and possibly negotiated over the sale of FCC licenses, to satisfy creditors), but hoped to reorganize to continue enabling MVNOs.

There have been 2 amendments to the bankruptcy filed in early to mid-October. Regardless of their hopes, it seems likely that the creditors and court may have some input into whether or not Limitless can reorganize minus the retail branch. Perhaps more importantly, it seems likely that the major carriers may not be (or may not have been?) willing to continue providing preferential wholesale access rates based on the "nationwide presence" needs of a retail provider that is no longer providing the services the preferential rates were based on.

Additional pieces of evidence of "going out of business" are probably out there-- but we'd be looking more at a bunch of ripples as more experienced MVNOs changed MVNE providers, while perhaps only more naive operators would have stayed with MMZ/PC Management/Limitless until things came crashing down.

Regarding 3):
3) Any entity involved as an MVNO enabler would have been willing to continue the relationship long enough to get CellNuvo safely to the other side, so Tom must not be telling the truth.

Unless they couldn't (see above, plus indications that parent company PC Management may be largely defunct.). Or unless they wanted to insulate themselves from the shrapnel (see above). Or unless they saw it as a dead-end market with only 1 remaining client that didn't justify the overhead. (see above).

Regarding the possible #4)
(And perhaps #4-- I don't like CN despite never having used it, so Tom must not be telling the truth.)

Sorry, I've got nothing to dispute that argument.

(edit: to correct a spelling error Sorry about the super-long hyperlink error-- I'm afraid to try to correct it!)

Thanks - interesting stuff.

As far as I am concerned it is quite obvious that something went wrong in the Mobile Matterz-Pc Management- Linda Martin-Limitless Mobile group and that negatively impacted cellnuvo. That is all I need to know. I can believe the story cellnuvo gave for the need to accelerate the big transition but I can also acknowledge they made some big mistakes.

I just wonder if there was some bad blood between the parties and that is what is holding up a lot of the numbers. It appears if sprint got involved then the PC Management group would spring to action as they probably have an ongoing relationship with them separate to cellnuvo.

At least I know all the remaining customers are better off with redpocket going forward. Once they get their system better aligned of course so we don't constantly lose service!

Thank You Kent!
Well thought- out forum postings are invaluable tools for those of us seeking information to make informed decisions! Please keep them coming.
Well done! Hats off!!

I just want a stable service. I don't care how CN does it I just want to be able to top-up my line. I just lost my service again and in-app store purchase is not working for me (again)! The last top-up lasted only few days then expired. This is just between CN and RP and they still can't get it together after all this time. This is NUTS!

Thanks Kent

For me personally. When I see a poster that does not use the service he bashes. That is enough for me to discount ALL they say. Not to bother reading what they write.

The fact that you wasted your time proving him wrong. Is just that a waste of your time. Since they will come in and try to take what you said apart.

For me it comes down to a person motives.

We all feel this way. I can tell you that Support told me that everything is good on their side and it is Redpocket.

That does not help us. I agree this is past too long of a wait.

They should give everyone service for 3 months and fix their issues. Why do we need to be without service for them to fix this?

Funny thing is, you actually do "bother reading it" and oft times proceed to respond and/or taunt.

If KentE deems it worthwhile to post his opinions, who the heck are you to say it is a waste?

What are yours?

Do not further talk to me or quote me. Stop Trolling me. End of discussion.


This is all getting really old.

Cellnuvo was good for some. Then the last two months struck and absolutely no one thinks it was a good period for cellnuvo. You either believe they will be good again or not. Simple as that.

I've been around one of the longest. I am confident they will get back to being a decent provider again. But expect it to be rocky for at least another month if not two. If you can't handle that move elsewhere. If not enjoy the ride. I'll be right there along with you.

For maybe the 20th time he questions OTHERS' motives...

...but now claims it's unacceptable for others to question HIS motives lol...

"Do as I say, not as I do."

You seem to be very unaware of what is happening here. Let me enlighten you.

JTSR71 has admitted to cellnuvo bashing and has been at it with me and lexusl21, KentE and a few others. For some reason he appears to hate cellnuvo vehemently to the point he will spend most of his time on this board hating on them. He has never used cellnuvo nor wants to.

JTSR71 was banned for 3 days last week. Maybe it was for something else but unlikely. Any repeat issues will probably result in a longer ban.

Legally-Speaking and JTSR71 are buddies.

See where this is going yet...

It is sad really. I welcome facts and valid criticisms of cellnuvo. But bashing is just stupid and having at it at users to gain a reaction isn't funny - it is just stupid.

Right, it's another "Do as I say, not as I do."

Cuz you, lexusl21, and I criticize CellNUVO too. What's wrong with that? Datapoints (mostly failure reports) from users are informative. So are simple yet investigative facts, like names and addresses of companies.

Burn any books lately, dude?

Thank you so very much for pointing out the hypocrisy.

As I said I welcome facts. If you look back you will see that I actually thanked JTSR71 for the names and addresses of the companies. Before you in fact. That is what is so sad about all of this. He is usually a valuable member of the forum. But this obvious bashing has to stop. And when I say that getting a buddy to do the dirty work isn't stopping. You seem to be blind to all the other comments that are not facts but are attempts to gain entertainment from provoking users.

I have a problem when facts are portrayed as facts when they are opinion. Like the recent claim that cellnuvo cannot be believed because of the fact that Mobile Matterz are still in business and they are the MVNE. Unfortunately it turns out there is much more to the story than that. I appreciated he brought forward the fact that Mobile Matterz claimed to be behind cellnuvo but not the wild conclusions with a sprinkle of prejudice.

So how exactly am I being hypocritical?

...and the beat goes on.